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PORTER ROCKWELL

Novelist trapped in a techie's body!
Articles Posted: 37  Links Seeded: 13
Member Since: 8/2010  Last Seen: 5/16/2012

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Repeating Rome's Decline

Sun Nov 6, 2011 10:00 PM EST
politics, conservatives, culture, civilization
By Porter Rockwell
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It's popular in some circles to say that we're going down the same drain that doomed the Roman Empire. "They" usually mean that Rome was corrupt and we're corrupt and if we don't mend our corrupt ways, then we're doomed! It's a little higher class than carrying a sign in Times Square reading, "The End Is Near!!" But not much.

A significant fact that most doomsayers seem to ignore is that during the most of the centuries that Rome was declining, it was run with an iron fist by Christians. When Rome was managed by an insiders club of good ol' boys, they were doing pretty well.

Nevertheless, "Those who choose to ignore history are condemned to repeat it." (A near quote of George Santayana.) So it's worthwhile to ask the question, "Just why did Rome fall?"

A theory that you don't hear quite as much as the "corruption" idea is that Rome died of lead poisoning. It goes something like this.

As Rome developed more services for it's citizens, they used lead to make their lives more comfortable. They painted their walls with lead based paint. They used lead pipes to bring water to their homes. They sealed their wine bottles with lead. They used lead for cosmetics, cups, and even coffins (which decayed and inevitably leached into the ground water).

And lead was used significantly more by the upper classes than the lower classes because only the upper classes could afford many of these comforts. The end result was that upper classes suffered more of the health problems which included low reproductive rates and, well, insanity. Need we mention Caligula who appointed his horse to the Roman Senate?

Nothing like that could affect us, of course. We're banishing lead from our lives. You haven't been able to buy lead based paint for decades and we've even removed it from gasoline.

But maybe there is something else? Remember, the Romans didn't understand what lead was doing to them at the time. If someone had told them, they probably would have refused to believe it.

In responding to a recent MSNBC article, I wrote, "Consider meat. Not only do they shoot those poor animals with every type and description of chemicals (to increase their profit margin, not to improve the animal's health), but the food they eat (grass, alfalfa, what's left over from slaughtering others of their kind) contains even worse chemicals because it's sprayed to kill insects and weeds for more profit. And, when the animal is slaughtered, it has just been run through a terrifying process and it's own endocrine system has flooded it's tissues with more chemicals. Eating that stuff (can/does?) make you crazy! Something that might account for much of what you see in politics these days."

Could this actually account for the rise of conservative thought in America? Is the religion of guns due to an excess of adrenaline in McBurgers? Is this why vegetarians (I'm one, by the way.) tend to be left wing? (I'm one of those, too!)

But we might not have quite as much of a problem as Rome had. Caligula appointed his horse to the Senate. So far, the Tea Party is only managing to get the back half into our Senate.

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  • Public Discussion (15)
westerncraig

According to your "logic" the same argument could be used against you vegatarians, and left wingers, and the democrats use a Jackass as their symbol. nuff said.

  • 1 vote
Reply#1 - Wed Nov 16, 2011 12:52 PM EST
smcutter

Visit a slaughterhouse sometime and you'll find that the slaughtering process is designed to be as relaxing as possible for the animals. When animals are stressed, they secrete the hormones you mentioned above which toughens the meat and significantly reduces the market value. As such, slaughterhouses are designed to provide the most soothing and stress-free environment possible.

  • 1 vote
Reply#2 - Wed Nov 16, 2011 1:41 PM EST
Porter Rockwell

Actually, smcutter, I did research this exact point. There are two schools of thought on this. Some people claim that the meat is tasteless unless the animal is traumatized as part of the process and go out of their way to do it.

But, obviously, I wouldn't know.

(Besides ... that's only one source of the stuff in meat that could be harmful.)

  • 1 vote
#2.1 - Thu Nov 17, 2011 6:25 PM EST
Jonathan-1917156

Our meat IS tasteless, but that is because our cattle generally is fast grown, and fed meal rather than being able to graze on grass. This is, as you say, for the purposes of profits and volume.

Try some argentinian beef for a very different taste and texture.

  • 1 vote
#2.2 - Fri Nov 18, 2011 12:37 AM EST
sky dog

Hunters know that a clean shot on an unsuspecting prey provides better meat. Both the hormones and the lactic acid from the exertion of running sours the meat to a small extent.

That, of course, is a different point than using DES (do they still do that?) and feeding cattle bio-dross.

    #2.3 - Fri Nov 18, 2011 11:32 AM EST
    Reply
    Everett WallaceDeleted
    Mike in Ga-

    True Liberal in every sense, by your ability to spin the fall of the Roman Empire cause to the introduction of lead paint, and eating meat. Caesar, corrupt politicians, greed, the quest for ultimate power over the entire world, and the destiny of the majority controlled by the elite political factions had nothing to do with it? I watched a History channel broadcast on this very topic recently and was amazed at how similar of a path we as Americans are on to our fall as was that of the Roman Empire. The signs are so obvious it's scary, and lead paint was never mentioned either.

      Reply#4 - Thu Nov 17, 2011 10:04 AM EST
      Porter Rockwell

      "True Liberal in every sense ..."

      Thanks for the compliment!!

      • 2 votes
      #4.1 - Thu Nov 17, 2011 6:26 PM EST
      Reply
      Jonathan-1917156

      You know the one thing that I was thinking, is if we elected horses (and other animals) into our government, could it really be any worse?

      Food for thought?

      • 1 vote
      Reply#5 - Fri Nov 18, 2011 12:42 AM EST
      IconoclastX

      The amount of manure generated would probably be the same.

      • 1 vote
      #5.1 - Fri Nov 18, 2011 10:52 AM EST
      Jonathan-1917156

      yeah but at least horse manure can be used as fertilizer.

      • 1 vote
      #5.2 - Fri Nov 18, 2011 12:56 PM EST
      Reply
      Pat P11111

      There may be an amount of truth in your idea that environmental poisons are influencing politic thoughts.

      IMO it is caused by poisons in our society. Society is where we all gather the information that we digest and turn into conclusions and patterns of thought. At an ever increasing rate purposeful misinformation is being introduced into our social information systems.

      Mass media is funded by marketers who pay to inject their message into the public consciousness. Up until the advent of radio and television print media was the main way of spreading marketing promotions.

      If that wasn't bad enough now we have 24/7 cable (so called news) that twist the events of the day into propaganda for political purposes. The internet is now becoming advanced enough to know your preferences and steer you to the information that it decides you need to know.

      We all live in information bubbles and mostly we are not aware of it. We watch the same news channel, read our favorite pundit and in so doing we wrap ourself in our own careful spun cocoons so that we hear what we want. The problem is we don't really think it through.

      I don't believe that all the Fox News viewers purposely set out with the goal to listen to the most untruthful channel on the air. Don't feel so superior either since you and I selected this article to read and focus on and it too is its own little bubble that will flavor the information that we swallow down today.

      • 3 votes
      Reply#6 - Sat Nov 19, 2011 7:05 PM EST
      Porter Rockwell

      That's true! I thought your comment was so good that I voted it up.

      I never claimed that the idea of poisoned food was the whole problem, just an interesting contributor. If you look at the totality of who says what, it seems quite clear to me that the most rabid, violent, and hysterical commentary seems to come from the people who probably consume the most meat. It's a long way from scientific proof, but I never said it was.

      The most compelling piece of evidence I have personally experienced was watching my wife go through a transition from being a heavy, heavy meat eater to no meat at all. There was a period of time - perhaps six months - where she became the most tranquil, calm and relaxed person! (As her body has adjusted, I think she's gone back to a more "normal" state of being. Darn!!!) That's a long way from scientific evidence too, but still ....

      Your comment really makes a lot of sense too. I like to focus on how TV is such a constant and unending series of lies.

      * Everybody Loves ...
      No they don't. I don't.

      * You'll feel the excitement when you drive ...
      I'd feel the debt, when I try to pay for it.

      * Feel instant relief with ...
      Feel constipation with ....

      And, of course, the grand champion lie being told by anybody, anywhere today:

      "Fair and Balanced"

        #6.1 - Sun Nov 20, 2011 10:05 AM EST
        Reply
        Wm. Sanders

        We clearly are in a decline. We've outsourced a lot of our manufacturing. We've started to outsource our white collar jobs. We may be on the verge of outsourcing our military (Hello Xe). Once the middle class vanishes, I would bet that would be the end game...without a buffer between the haves (the 1%) and the have nots (the remaining 99%), along with the inevitable environmental degradation (you can't burn that much coal and not expect consequences), the tipping point will be sudden and violent.

        I only hope I'm not around to see it happen, but more than likely it will happen...esp. if things remain the way they are.

        • 2 votes
        Reply#7 - Sat Nov 19, 2011 7:21 PM EST
        Porter Rockwell

        I truely like being an old codger these days. I figure that I'll be gone just about the time things get really bad. Have you read my essay, "What's Your Prediction" above?

        Besides, as "Red Green" says, "One of the really great things about being an old codger is that you can get away with stuff that would have gotten you thrown out if you were twenty years younger."

        • 1 vote
        #7.1 - Sun Nov 20, 2011 10:14 AM EST
        Reply
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